My 5 years are up! How did I do?
Inspirational graffiti of the week
5 Years!
They say a picture paints a thousand words and I think that round yellow face pretty much sums it up for me. Post over I guess!
Haha, as if I’d let you off that easily… prepare for a 2000+ word slog on the epic 5 year journey of yours truly!
As a bit of a TL;DR – I am quite surprised reading back over some of my old posts that the main aim and underlying plan has actually been pretty consistent since day one, and I have largely achieved that initial goal. This is despite my personal circumstances changing massively and our expenses in all likelihood going up in that time.
The big storyline for me is about the development of side hustles, which although were part of the initial plan, have turned out in ways that even I could never have predicted when I started down this ol’ yellow brick road to FI.
In fact as is sometimes the case with my yearly updates, I think I’ll split this out over a couple of posts so it doesn’t get too long. In the next instalment, I’ll highlight some of the posts which provide an insight into how my thinking has changed along that way or have been important updates in general, as well as just some of my favourite posts in general that could be unrelated to much else, as well as some general rambling on 5 years of blogging and the FI life in general.
But first… it would be incredibly negligent of me not to go through some of the top line financial figures from the 5 years I’ve been in this game.
5 year financial round up
First of all, I’ll just keep this to the real important figures, otherwise we’ll be here all day, and secondly, apologies for the lack of figures from the start. I guess I had more enthusiasm for blogging about these FI ideas than actually getting a handle on our financial situation to begin with… d’oh!
First of all: Expenses, Income, and Savings Rate
A few notes on the above:
- Figures in blue are estimates. In 2014 I tracked expenses/income in the last 7 months of the year, so I’ve just extrapolated that out for the rest of the year.
- The July 2018 column is simply figures up to July of this year, as that is as far as we’ve gotten so far. I know August is basically over but I wanted to just get this post out and can’t be bothered to wait a few more days to include those figures 🙂
- In the 2018 FC (Forecast) column I’ve used the figures up to July and done the same, with one exception which is the income. For income here, due to the massive outlier that was July (25K income!) I’ve taken the average from Jan-June, multiplied by 11, then added on the 25K from July. This seemed like a fair way of doing it, but still produced an eye popping figure of 87K income. To be fair, knowing what’s happened in August pretty much already, I know both the spending and income figures are going to be lowballed here (we bought a car for 3.5K for example, and on the income you will have to wait to find out 😉 ) but up until July this was a good estimate.
Now a few of my thoughts on the above:
- It looks like our spending is gradually going up, which is a shame. Lifestyle inflation? Or just normal inflation? Or just the “costs of having a kid”? Probably a bit of all of the above I would imagine.
- You can see where I went part time sometime early in 2016 really took a hit to the income side of things. Je regrette rien! Also Mrs T took a year off for maternity and then only went back to work part time as well. Considering all of the above, the hit doesn’t really look that bad at all. Side hustling really did help with this regard quite considerably.
- Also, even not regarding the ~17K windfall we had in July 2018, we are on track for at least 70K income in 2018, which is pretty much amazing. We might even beat our highest figure of 71K in 2015 in fact. In fact I am going to make that my target to do so! Beat our old full time wages on part time working, that sounds good to me 🙂
- We’ve never achieved that illustrious 50% savings rate which is a shame, but the reasons for this are obvious (PT work plus being
a bitfar too liberal on the expenses). There is a squeak of a chance of us doing it this year but it’s going to be tough and will rely on my side hustle income remaining strong. - I know it’s not an entirely accurate way of working it out, but just taking the average of those 5 yearly savings rate figures gives us an overall figure of 38.63%. Not too bad!
- If we kept that savings rate up, I calculate we’d hit full FIRE in 18.6 Years, at which point I will be 55. It could theoretically be brought forward due to our mortgage being practically paid off at that stage so our expenses will drop by a large amount, our earnings went up (Mrs T could go back to full time work once TFS Jr is in school or I could quit my job to start a wildly successful business 🙂 for example), or get better than expected investment gains and/or other large windfalls. On the other hand this assumes we have no more children, don’t ever want to move house again, I don’t decide to quit my job and try something else (and fail miserably at it), and our yearly expenses don’t increase for whatever reason and/or we are hit with some unexpected really large one off expenses. So all in all, I am happy that this is a good estimate.
Now… onto Net Worth
Notes/thoughts on the above:
- The first line, July 2013, is very much an estimate, which was gleaned from my post here. I guessed that my work pension value was £26,000 around that time which comprised the large bulk of Net Worth when we stared out, along with house equity. As you can see any other savings/cash amounted to a mere £4000!
- The July 2014 figures are also somewhat estimated (due to me not including pension in my figures yet again… d’oh. I don’t know why I didn’t think to include this as it is obviously a large part of anyone’s NW even if they are quite young!). Anyway I estimated that it was £33,000 this year.
- Even though our savings rate was pretty meagre during 2016/17 the net worth increases were still pretty good all round. Compound interest doing it’s thang!
Did I complete my goal(s)?
My goal was a bit wishy washy, almost deliberately so, because there were so many unknown variables when I started out. I had no idea about investing and what sort of performance I might get, and also what our expenses actually were – although it seems I deluded myself into thinking 10K/year/person was possible for us… oh young FIREStarter… how naive you were 1! And the main thing was I had no idea how our income would evolve or how my side hustles would pan out (or even what they would be at that point).
Nonetheless let’s just remind us of the main tenets of my plan/goal, from here:
Part I:
- Live well below your means
- Save aggresively (50%+ of net income)
- Invest the savings in passive income producing stocks, bonds and property
Part II
- Side Hustles: Develop alternative passive income streams
I would say apart from hitting a 50% savings rate, I did really well on these overarching goals!
From the same post, here is the table which shows actually what I thought I was aiming for, the green highlighted line was the “target”:
Now aside from this being wildly inaccurate planning 🙂 – I did actually pretty much hit this goal.
Hah!
Yes that even surprised me. I always had the figure of £250K Net Worth in my head all this time as that was obviously mentioned in that original post (£250K at 4% SWR = £10k spending/year), but I didn’t actually realise I had *cleverly* offset this with “alternate passive income”. Maybe I should have gone back and read my plans a bit more often.
So in any case, our “liquid freedom” pot which is really what we’re talking about here, because anything in Pensions is no good for producing income until we are 67 or whatever is it now. And that stood at £99,768 which I am going to call a “hit” on this goal!
However, there are a few of other factors here which make all of the above outright nonsense, such as:
- This plan was clearly for me only, whereas there are 2 adults in our house and our Net Worth is combined. I’m not sure I knew or even asked Mrs T what she thought about any of this at the stage I posted those original goals! So the 100K in Liquid Freedom is really only 50K… wwaaah waaah waaaaaaaah 2
- Another negative is that we clearly do not spend 10K/person/year. Oops. Pretty much out on that one by a factor of 100%. Double (literally) oops.
- I’ve actually smashed the back doors off the side hustle income in the last few years! I have “Alternative Passive Income” down as £500/month but I’m currently averaging over £3K/month with the each way sniping, and even before that I was averaging just over £600/month on the matched betting front over 2016/17. Not sure how long the mega EW profits will continue, but it doesn’t seem to be showing any signs of slowing down right now, although clearly I cannot rely on this forever.
- Finally, if I invested the 100K fully to produce 4% SWR, plus 3K per month each way sniping, I could probably in theory just give up work right now as that would be around 40K/year to spend, and that is roughly what we are spending, and if push came to shove we could easily cut some fat out of our, admittedly, very spendy life (by FIRE crowd standards at least).
- However I’m clearly not going to do that! It would make things really tight, and not allow us to save any further money, which is not ideal, but if I did quit I would definitely start to look at other business ideas. It would just make things a little too stressful I think to make it palatable right now. And besides, let’s not forget…
I already hit my “goal” of quitting full time work ages ago anyway!
Again, from the post reference above:
… there are a multitude of things you may want to do once you’ve hit your target savings plus passive/side hustle income goals:
- Slow Travel The World knowing you have a nest egg to fall back on
- Spend more time with friends and family
- Work part time and enjoy the extra free time to pursue other non income producing interests
OK, so this was not a specific goal from the very second I started the blog (as I said, I’d kept things vague deliberately to start with) but it very quickly became a viable and desirable option as time went on, and I transitioned to this working arrangement in September 2015.
So anyway, all told I feel I’ve done pretty well. We saved up a bunch of money, I could in theory quit my job tomorrow and cover our expenses with an (admittedly risky) side hustle, and all of the while mainly working part time, moving to a more expensive house, and having a kid.
I know I’m tooting my own horn here but I don’t care, for once I’m just going to not be modest and just say… well done TFS 🙂
And thanks to all the readers who have followed me along the way, I couldn’t have stuck this out without you!
Cheers to another 5 years 🙂
Look out for part 2 coming up soon which will be mainly more rambling from my good self!
Notes:
- Although it must be said it clearly is possible. Evidence from new blog on the scene The Savings Ninja, for example! ↩
- That’s the funny trombone “fail” noise by the way, not a “wah” cry/moan. Just in case anyone wanted clarification ↩
Discussion (29) ¬
Nice one mate – should be very happy!
Matched betting has been your secret sauce, I wouldn’t say it’s passive though? How long do you spend on it?
Hi Chris,
That is a pretty good point, although I’m not entirely sure what I really meant by “Alternative passive income”. I am guessing I thought I would make some websites that ran themselves and made me £500/month!? Not very likely and in fairness I probably did just mean find some side hustles that were fairly low time input but would provide decent income, which is exactly what the MB/EW has turned out to be.
I would estimate I am spending about 10-15 hours a week in total but around half of those are at work (tee hee) and a further 3-4 are just doing bets on my phone while I’m otherwise not particularly busy doing anything else. So actual time out of my day I could be doing something else productive or relaxing or whatever I would honestly say it’s only about 3-4 hours per week (and that is mainly just updating my spreadsheet in the evenings). I’m not saying everyone can do that of course, but it works amazing well for me on a time input/money output equation. And even if I did count those 10-15 hours fully, it’s still an incredible £/hour anyway.
Cheers!
Great to see this recap of the last five years. I think I’ve been following you (silently) for a good 4 years of that, and it’s been great to see you make all this progress! I’m truly amazed by your monthly EW sniping income.
Ah that’s so cool, thanks for following me for the lions share, and I’m glad you decided to un-silence yourself eventually (and start a cool blog! We love Thailand!)
Interesting summary and well done to you all! I can see parallels and differences with my own situation.
I was always a little vague about my own goals on the grounds that I’d know ’em when I saw ’em. I always thought total wealth of around £1m would do it – but turns out I need rather less Also “forgot” about the missus until it became obvious she was unlikely to work again. Also developed a side hustle. Also focussed on high savings rate while taking advantage of a medium term boost to income. Also have a somewhat flexible fund of £100K. Lastly, also went part-time.
Our running costs about 1/3 of yours though. In part, because I pursued a target of paying off future bills first. I chose to pay off the much smaller mortgage (<£100K). I've then shifted focus to pension and have been lucky enough to ride the stock market boom in recent years. The pension pot is now over £400K and I am targeting 55 rather than 67. Lastly, I'm thinking a flexible fund of around £100K-£150K should see us through – particularly if I continue some form of part-time working/side hustle.
Hi C,
I think starting out in some manner is far more important than knowing what your exact end goal is! No point in procrastinating over it, there is so much that can change throughout life that is largely out of our control anyway, and being flexible is key to achieving FI or just having a decent/less stressful life in general, I believe.
With our current spending we will need around £1 million as well, but I have a hankering feeling it will turn out a lot less than that (in real terms at least) due to the mortgage being all but paid off by the time we reach true FI.
Your running costs are 1/3rd of ours… sheesh. That makes me feel bad haha. I make that around 14K/year for the two of you? That is mega frugal in my book even if you have no mortgage, kudos to you! Isn’t the pension pot already big enough to cover that though? 400 * 4% = 16K? So all you need is the stash to tide you over till you can draw that. You could use the tax free lump sum at 55 to your advantage as well.
Obviously you will want some sort of buffer zone in case of market tanks in the first few years of FIRE, but sounds like you are pretty much already there (sorry it didn’t say how old you are so not sure how close to 55 you actually are. If it’s just around the corner then all makes sense!)
Cheers for sticking up your numbers/situ, always good to see how others are going about it 🙂
Yes, I called FI early last year. Re: frugal. We don’t live in the SE or have a nipper and enjoy doing free/low expense things (we live in the countryside). We also chose a modest house with low running costs. No car. Solar panels and access to plenty of free wood mean our utility bills are low. Agewise, in mid 40s.
Personally, I think 4% withdrawal rate is a little bullish. I don’t know exactly what is right – but I’d hate to be blindsided by a large roof repair bill and I know the missus would like to travel a bit more than we have historically done so. Lastly, both of us are experimenting with learning new skills which require tuition.
Aha… well that makes perfect sense now then 🙂
That’s awesome that you have pretty much cut your estimated needed pot roughly in half from what I can gather?! Really inspiring stuff. Maybe there is hope for us yet 🙂
I agree that 4% is a little bullish if you are never planning on earning any money ever again, but for ER’s who are interested in things, I am sure it would be very easy to bring in say 5K/year per person which would be worth 400K for two people. So that’s why I’m not really that bothered about that just yet. Maybe as I hurtle towards traditional retirement age I will start to worry about getting our SWR down to 3% or so.
Travel and new skills sounds like a great way to be spending your freedom 🙂
Cheers!
Great update TFS – I love hearing how everyone is progressing on their journey. It’s awesome you are both working part time spending time with your kids and achieving your financial goals. You are winning at life.
Moreover, I like to see how life changes have influenced and helped you tweak the plan along the way. And yeah – that £10k a year was a bit on the ambitious side!
Hah, thank you Ms ZiYou. It certainly does feel like we are winning at life and it’s good to acknowledge that and be grateful about it… something I most definitely am!
Yea… it is somewhat regrettable, but we just never were able to go through that whole “resetting our spending” type of epiphany that some people get. There was just never the desire. I think our spending habits have been locked in throughout our twenties, having lived as “Adults” for a whole decade fending for ourselves, and are now just too ingrained. On the other hand, we have never been in debt (as a couple, mortgage aside of course) and have always managed to save so there has never really been an urgent cause to strip everything down to basics.
Have to admit as well, as the betting income has increased, it makes it very hard not just go… yea £200 on a new X,Y or Z is fine (or even more in the case of the new car), knowing we will have an over 50% savings rate that month anyway. I guess I’ve been “anchored” into thinking that 50% is amazing even though there are tonnes of other people smashing out 70%+ every month and some of them are not on mega high wages as well and have done it on the expenses side of the equation.
Either way though, I am happy with living a little for today, while still saving a fair bit for tomorrow, and we have got a pretty good balance with that, for us.
It is always fascinating to revisit how we once thought the future would look. A fun combination of hopes, dreams and naivety!
Well done for sticking with it, and the progress made over 5 years. Is great to see lifestyle choices (kids, part time work, etc) driving the financial choices rather than the other way around.
Hi indeedably,
Yes, I’m glad I started the blog for many reasons but one is that it is really great to go back and get a snap shot of how you thought at any given point in time. Fascinating indeed(ably?)! 🙂
That’s a really cool last point, and one I’ve not really thought about before. Most people, it seems to me at least, do tend to look at their financial situation and then fit their lifestyle around that, rather than work out what lifestyle they really want to be living and work it the other way round.
Nice insight! Cheers!
Oh also I just checked out your post here:
https://indeedably.com/i-own/
And I love the working arrangement you currently have! I can definitely see myself trying something like that in a few years time once our coffers are a bit more full. Winter is for working, summer is for playing… totally with you on that one! 🙂
Cheers again!
Thanks TFS.
It is amazing what becomes possible once we stop telling ourselves that “they” will never agree to that, and instead give ourselves permission to try. Doesn’t always work of course, but tends to work out more often than you may expect! Your working part time is a good example of that in action, as is my winters camped out in a nice warm office.
Epic 5-year recap there, TFS! As you know, I came across your blog early 2014 and what I read inspired me to start my own blog, so cheers once again! I recall you used to write a lot about food too! 🙂
Goals are meant to be flexible because life can be and usually is flexible. Good point about not knowing what the exact goal is when you start off, better to just start than to procrastinate. Hence my own goal right at the beginning was based on ‘back of the fag packet’ type of calculations – it’s moved on a bit since then but still isn’t set in stone.
Your £10k a year post is still one of my favourites and I return to it every so often. I think living on my own, if I wanted to do the real extreme frugal nun thing, I could get close to that £10k but it wouldn’t be a very happy existence!
And thank you for getting me on the matched betting road and helping me out when needed. You’re smashing it profits-wise and can afford to to spend some of it, whilst getting a great savings rate!
Looking forward to reading part 2!
Yes, I did used to write a bit about food! I still like food but haven’t really come up with much new on that front. I just mash everything together with rice or pasta to make sure nothing is wasted 🙂
Maybe I do need to have a look though and see if there has been anything new worth writing about. I have some baby recipes I suppose that are new… not sure if you’d be interested in that though 😀
I agree, I think if I really put my mind to it I could do the 10K/year thing, if single and without child. If no mortgage then it would be a piece of piss.
No worries on the MB stuff and glad I could help! 🙂
All the best to your good self as usual weenie
I like it – it’s good to see someone else who have high spending and doesn’t spend their life in a cave eating baked beans from a can.
5 years shows a lot of progress and I think you are heading in the right direction!
and I’m really envious of your side hussle – I’ve no time for it myself but you manage it and you are smashing it!
Yea it could have been more, we could have done better. But the overall trajectory has been a massive positive move in the right direction and at the end of the day we had a fun packed 5 years to boot!
Cheers GFF!
Congrats!
I’ve heard once you hit that magical 100k networth everything starts to take-off, looks like this is the case for you too!
Question – how did you approach going part-time with your boss?
Thanks,
Sam
Hi Sam,
Yea, I guess that is where real compounding starts to happen, although I most certainly now need to look at investing some of our Liquid Freedom as a huge chunk of it is just cash (although a lot is a float for MB/EW stuff, so that can’t go in, and another chunk I would like to keep as cash anyway, but still… we are definitely over now on our cash allocation than I’d like).
Fairly long story but the short version is that I said I was going to quit unless I could work part time hours pretty much! They originally just agreed that I would quit (hah!) but then changed their mind a few months later after the time got nearer, and I came to them with a more solid plan of how the PT thing could actually work for both parties. If you look at posts from around end 2015 and throughout 2016 the full story should be in there somewhere.
Cheers!
Lovely to read your review of the last 5 years TFS. It’s amazing to see the progress you’ve made towards your goals, more so the life ones than the money ones because that’s what really matters. You can read through your posts that they come from a place of happiness rather than frustration and that is heart-warming.
Good luck for the next 5 years!
Thanks YoungFIGuy glad you enjoyed it.
I think I was already a generally an optimistic person, and have become more satisfied with how my life has been going every year since starting down this path, so yes I agree the large part of my posts have come from a place of happiness (hopefully never smug though! 🙂 – with the occasional few being a bit whiney or ranty. It’s always good to have a rant every now and again when the mood takes you I think 🙂
Cheers and to you too with your continued life of leisure 😉
I’m very proud for you 😀 The first 100k is the hardest they say! You’ve done very well to blog for this long too, your site is a treasure trove!
I don’t think my expenses will be staying at the revered 10k mark for long after I have children 🙂
Huge congratz on the benchmark!
Aww thanks Ninja!
Hah, well we have found a child didn’t necessarily increase our budget initially but we were already in a large enough house to house her. I believe you are in a maisonette and so could probably get away with 1 in there, depends on how many you want really?
I think with your frugal nature you could still do it though… Show us how its done buddy! 🙂
Cheers
Hey TFS,
Huge congrats on your 5 years. I love how down to earth your blog is, plus the fact that it’s about FIRE, but telling an alternative story of how it doesn’t have to involve extreme frugality.
It’s great to see how your net worth has grown over the years, that’s what it’s all about!
Looking forward to the next 5…
Corinna
Thank you Corinna for your kind words!
I hope I can stick it out for another 5 years, as still having fun and learning a lot by running the blog which is what it’s all about for me.
Cheers
This is massively inspiring! You might have had the ‘wrong’ target in mind but you still hit it hard. If I am where you are in 5 years I’ll be more than happy.
I remember reading your £10k post, probably back when you fist published it, and thought it looked doable enough, though possibly uncomfortable. Time to see what my expenses look like and take up the challenge I think!
Great to hear that ThisTime.
It’s a bit scary to think how long even 5 years head is when you are starting out on the path to FI, and how slow progress seems to be when along the way. But looking back it is great to see how much progress we actually made and hopefully people can see this as an example of how much you can do without honestly trying all that much in terms of maximising income and cutting expenses (especially the second one haha!)
Good luck on the 10k challenge, it wasn’t for me in the end obviously but I applaud anyone who wants to give it a go!
Cheers!